Wednesday 4 August 2010

New Zealots

Having mentioned yesterday the anti-tobacco extremism in the Antipodes, it is timely that ASH (New Zealand) have popped up to make my point for me. New Zealand is one of the few places in the world where anti-smoking campaigners don't even bother pretending not to be prohibitionists, hence...

Smoking: Majority of NZers want sales banned

The majority of New Zealanders support an end to commercial tobacco sales by 2020, a UMR Research survey has found.

You can guess who commissioned this survey.

ASH spokesman Michael Colhoun said the results released today showed the public believed "enough is enough" and it was time for strong action to be taken on tobacco.

"The momentum has been built up over the past year, including the tobacco excise increase and I think we've reached a tipping point," said Mr Colhoun.

Now then. It is possible that the majority of New Zealanders do want smoking banned in the next 9 and a half years (although the comments to this article suggest that perhaps they don't). Admittedly, it would make New Zealand rather unusual since every survey since the 1960s has shown that only 30% or so of the population harbour such prohibitionist thoughts.

But even if there is now a Kiwi majority, I'm not convinced that this question is sufficiently robust to separate the hardcore from the merely confused:

The survey, for anti-smoking group Action on Smoking and Health (ASH), asked 750 respondents if they agreed or disagreed that "New Zealand should be a completely Smokefree nation by 2020. This means smoked tobacco would not be widely available for sale."

Fifty-nine percent of respondents "agreed" or "strongly agreed" with the statement, ASH said.

"Tobacco would not be widely available for sale"? What the hell does this mean? It wouldn't be widely available in playgrounds? It wouldn't be widely available in tobacconists? And didn't New Zealand become a 'smokefree nation' when it brought a smoking ban in back in 2004? Weren't they told, like we Brits were, that that was what 'going smokefree' meant?

To ASH, it seems, "not widely available" means completely illegal and "smokefree" means banning the sale, purchase and consumption of smoked tobacco. So if that's what they mean—and if that's how they're going to spin it in a press release—why don't they ask people if they want tobacco to be completely illegal? Could it be because they wouldn't get quite the same answer?


These people are deadly serious.

Mr Colhoun says while the crackdown on tobacco will be heavy; people who wish to grow their own tobacco can continue to do so.

“At the moment you can grow up to 15kg a year for personal use; people who want to put tobacco plants in their backyard – they can do that and we’ll never end that,” he says.

Of course not. Why, that would be excessive.

So there you have it—a cast-iron guarantee from ASH (New Zealand) who, 25 years ago, were calling for a smoking ban on domestic flights. Not on international flights obviously. Or in bars and restaurants. That would have been excessive.


Smoking Hot said...

Sometimes l wonder why we even bother to blog on this anymore. Do you really think they'd ask the people? They wouldn't dream of it because they'd give the wrong answer. Didn't Clegg just do that?

l should just start to look for suitable premises to become 'Speak Easys' and source tobacco supplies and routes. Should do the same for alcohol as there is little doubt now of where that is going too. Oh, l was forgetting about the hamburgers.

Atleast we won't have to think of gangster nicknames ... we've already got them! :)

Leg-iron said...

I have a polycarbonate greenhouse. Friends with glass ones line them with bubble-wrap for insulation and to disperse direct sunlight.

Either way, it means you can't see what's growing in there ;)

All you need do is have some tomatoes and peppers too, so you come out with produce that arouses no suspicion.

Drying and curing I have yet to try. There are lessons on the internet though.

We're ready for them.

Nick2 said...

“At the moment you can grow up to 15kg a year for personal use; people who want to put tobacco plants in their backyard – they can do that and we’ll never end that,” he says.

But for how long could anyone rely on that guarantee?

JJ said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

The main stream media will not report the truth about tobacco.
Scare stories sell the truth does not.
It has now got to the point where even seeminly rational individuals swallow the anti smoking propaganda for instance most people believe smoking blackens the lungs ,it does not lung cancer cuases blackening of the lungs ,in non smokers as well.

JJ said...

Unless and until we discredit these zealots in the main stream media then this crap will never go away.

Even if you were to grow your long do you think it will take the jack-boot brigade to come knocking on your door?

We're always on the back foot trying to defend ourselves - that has to change!

RdM said...

It's the first next wave of the "confidence trick" propaganda - setting the scene for the reporting back of the Maori Affairs Select Comittee , after a brief hiatus - see the main paper propaganda record: - during which the head of it, Tau Henare, was persuaded to go on to Champix & promptly had a heart attack - now run by the original instigator, Hone Hitler - er, Harawira - utterly 'gamed', IMO, by global ASH & SFC - but very anti-smoking already;- an ideal 'useful idiot'!?

They are and have been serious for some time now! NZ has IMO been globally targeted because of its global isolation - smuggling is difficult - and placid populace, who have little idea what is happening, and there are plenty of zealots in the media. See the "Your Comments" links in some of the nzherald pages for examples... although it's also encouraging that a few non-smokers protest against perceived freedom restrictions. Hardly enough ...

'They' et al are deadly serious about achieving a total ban - an exemplar for the Goodber (soviet inspired, no?) doctrine - by 2020 (abitrary date!)

Bhutan is talked up - where suicide & obesity is rising!

[NB: growing is difficult enough;- curing & etc. is all! - GOOD tobacco needs 1-3+yrs - FAR more than home brew beer, or marijuana, say;- more like wine, let alone good spirits - that's *why* companies were formed! It's prohibition by stealth & lies ... reducing it to a few later-easily-targeted home-growers will knock out several hundred years of tobacco culture & knowledge. See for pipe tobacco reviews that equal any wine or whisky or whiskey reviews ... ]

Cultricide ... the killing of a culture?

The story breaking today had an interview - the host no doubt picked for his own anti views - - I can't get the audio to work, on the right, beyond a part of it.

There are some 677,000 reported smokers in NZ, IIRC, so given some under-reporting, say 700k+. So a survey of 750 people - who agree to a telephone survey interview - is approx in the .001% ballpark.

Hardly representative!

In Jan 2010 we had PR propaganda that "Kiwis want cigarettes banned by 2020" from "1608 people, including 422 smokers" - a very crafted "survey" that was later used in the tax rise 'debate' (see below) - (the HSC is another set-up!)

But for a really chilling experience, check out the video of one of the last presentations to the Select Comittee, the blowhard liar (in my personal opinion!) - employed by Pfizer and Johnson & Johnson before he 'blew the whistle', conveniently, then given a grant to set up Smoke-Free Kids (by J&J?) - who rants on about additive-free tobacco [I have been paying extra for it! - google Manitou, for instance!] and (of course!) against e-cigarettes!

See the video at

NB the hushed aura for 'the great man' and the pathetic, barely any questioning ... this was ASH-SFC's last 'trump card', after ~2000 submissions over 6 months, to this 'Inquiry'... read inquisition - and these people, heavily adviced, not merely advised, are about to, primed to, report to Parliament with proposed new laws... unless real public ire is aroused!!!

Or unless (too late for submissions!) significant counter-informations are publicly seeded.

What's especialy frightening is that the last recent round of tobacco taxes was put through under urgency (no public foreknowledge or consultation!) with almost all MP's voting for it:

We really need some help, here - else NZ will become about as isolated as Novaya Zemlya!


Pat Nurse MA said...

ASH's ultimate aim is to make tobacco illegal and criminalise smokers who still refuse to quit. They have to get us in the minority first and then they'll go for the kill. They are moving to that stage in the game as I write.

The sham premise of "caring" about people affected by big bad tobacco companies is gone. ASH's new role once they get tobacco use criminalised will be enforcer.

Make no mistake, if we do not turn this around, this is where the issue will take us.

JJ said...

Pat - I'm afraid you're right. This wild eyed maniacal zealotry will not abate until all smokers and tobacco in totally eradicated.

Even when death grants us merciful release from this monstrous tyranny...they'll just dig us up and start all over again.

I feel civil disobedience coming on.

Anonymous said...

'I feel civil disobedience coming on'

Don't hold your breath - what's really frightening is that the general public is too stupid to realise what's happening.

Pat Nurse MA said...

The majority of the general public doesn't smoke so has no interest. They won't recognise it as an issue of freedom until they find something they like banned. Even then they will be a minority of whatever it is.

The zealots can only work and achieve by first marginalising minorities and then attacking that minority with public support.

Yes civil disobedience is needed. Join the Resistance, spread thre word about that and do what you can to publicise. It is at least a step in the right direction

DaveA said...

While on the Antipodes theme Champix suicide toll in Australia rises.

Anonymous said...

I believe the tide has turned against ASH and they know it,why else the rush to total prohibition.
They think by getting a law passed that it cant get repealed very quickly if elections change ash's political fortunes within the govmnt. Tobacco control knows their political movements on life support worldwide as the govmnts that supported them are being voted out by the people and their moneys dry up. Its merely a matter of time before bans start getting repealed either in part or entirety. In tenn there are several legislators with bills already filled out to put on the house floor to repeal the statewide ban........the same holds true in many other states I am sure.....harleyrider1978

E. Cigs said...

Majority of people from all over the countries wants the same that everyone wants to ban the sales of the cigarettes.

DaveA said...

@E Cigs

The way things are going E cigs will be banned in the USA and the UK too.

This is not ASH NZ's first attempt to float the idea of bannimg tobacco. They mentioned it first in 2007.

Kris said...

Not sure if google translate can do the trick here for you, but over here in Holland the Dutch version of ASH (Stivoro) exactly suggested prohibition as an ultimate goal about 6 weeks ago.
Seems to me there is no longer any velvet glove in tobacco control, but to be honest:It is exactly his kind of openness that should be encouraged.Now everyone knows what they want.

Pat Nurse MA said...

Sadly, too many don't care about this openess because they do not care about smoking prohibition because it doesn't affect them.
It does, however, give us ammunition to try and wake them up before this kind of zealotry affects whatever it is that they do like.