tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post4549595433873449443..comments2023-10-17T15:56:22.827+01:00Comments on Velvet Glove, Iron Fist: The poison pen of Johann HariChristopher Snowdonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15963753745009712865noreply@blogger.comBlogger133125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-31830631274127419302011-10-07T04:14:50.876+01:002011-10-07T04:14:50.876+01:00He might not have got settled in Columbia yet; sur...He might not have got settled in Columbia yet; sure he's got lots on...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-14305943571896276632011-10-06T16:22:52.934+01:002011-10-06T16:22:52.934+01:00Zafio,
I don't know how often you look at the...Zafio,<br /><br />I don't know how often you look at the email account you used to correspond with me, but you have an email.<br /><br />Best wishes<br />DavidJack of Kenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00519002603649560097noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-90566817282564847782011-09-29T23:02:18.861+01:002011-09-29T23:02:18.861+01:00@Johann Harry
If you find out where the right for...@Johann Harry<br /><br />If you find out where the right forum is nowadays, let me know.I miss the good old days of last week when it was all playing out here.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-27762675369475211602011-09-29T02:08:55.902+01:002011-09-29T02:08:55.902+01:00Did anyone actually listen to Blackhurst on Radio ...Did anyone actually listen to Blackhurst on Radio 4? From what he said and how he said it, I think he is a bit pissed off that AWS didn't conduct a proper inquiry and that because of AWS' standing, he can't quibble with his (hopelessly inadequate) investigation and findings. He did not sound like someone who was comfortable with the decision to keep Hari. And I think that's why he wishes he could have off-loaded the decision to the PCC. <br /><br />That's what I gathered, anyway. <br /><br />Happy to be contradicted. Or ignored, as this page has probably stopped being the right forum for all this...Johann Harrynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-23588612981446523922011-09-28T12:11:38.699+01:002011-09-28T12:11:38.699+01:00Here's how this plays out
Scenario 1:
JoK fin...Here's how this plays out<br /><br />Scenario 1:<br />JoK finds proof that Zafio is Hari, and says so, unmasking him like the final reel of a Scooby Doo episode.<br /><br />Scenario 2:<br />Zafio proves to JoK that he is in fact an independent person. JoK comes here and says so.<br /><br />Scenario 3:<br />Zafio doesn't prove his independent existence to JoK's satisfaction despite having independent multiple social media account going back 3 years. In this case, JoK is likely to say nothing more, since he has nothing further to add.<br /><br />So the silence here speaks volumes.<br />And Zafio's faith in checkuser is touching. All he needs is have accounts with seperate ISPs for each sock. His confidence in checkuser actually speaks against him, since he shouldn't know the details of the David Rose internet connections.<br /><br />I think it would be interesting to ask Columbia what they think about having a serial plagiarist and sock-puppeteer studying there.Dead Dog Bouncehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11820417398024917317noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-4972164051037331092011-09-27T10:51:07.974+01:002011-09-27T10:51:07.974+01:00Seems to have gone very quiet. JoK, nothing to rep...Seems to have gone very quiet. JoK, nothing to report?<br />Or is it the chill of libel I feel?Dannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-32623259967307500832011-09-23T22:44:41.835+01:002011-09-23T22:44:41.835+01:00Can't really see Cristina taking the moral hig...Can't really see Cristina taking the moral highground about being smeared...<br /><br />http://www.neilmonnery.co.uk/2011/09/15/cristina-odone-desperate-lie-johann-hari-lied/Augustinenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-11214574572989753642011-09-23T12:16:28.568+01:002011-09-23T12:16:28.568+01:00Eye Spy Trouble:"Andreas Whittam Smith, the C...<a href="http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/theroyalfamily/8779910/Duke-of-York-has-lunch-with-Bin-Laden.html" rel="nofollow">Eye Spy Trouble</a>:<i>"Andreas Whittam Smith, the Church Commissioner brought in by </i>The Independent<i> to “investigate” Johann Hari, the paper’s resident plagiarist, came face to face on Wednesday with Cristina Odone and Nick Cohen, who both had their Wikipedia entries falsified maliciously by Hari.<br /><br />Whittam Smith, </i>The Independent<i>’s founder, has been accused of a whitewash after his inquiry led to Hari’s remaining on the paper, albeit after a few months’ journalism training.<br /><br />“Before the lunch, we were warned not to talk about it,” says Odone of the ill-assorted gathering at the </i>Private Eye<i> lunch. “All I would say is that it was emotional.”</i><br /><br />I bet.A Wikipedia Editorhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/David_r_from_meth_productionsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-84815483381648961262011-09-23T10:45:07.780+01:002011-09-23T10:45:07.780+01:00When you start looking systematically at Hari'...When you start looking systematically at Hari's archives, it becomes absolutely ridiculous that so many of his articles have been passed unopposed (as far as I'm aware - I realise that Private Eye flagged up some likely fibs a long time ago, but it doesn't seem to have been common knowledge that Hari's stuff included dubious material).<br /><br />I imagine lots of people had, like me, read various of his articles without reading them back to back and seeing the improbabilities multiply. <br /><br />There is so much frankly incredible material in there. I'm a bit detail-obsessive, but I really want someone to take the Hari archive on as a full-time job. Clear out the stables and find out exactly how much shite has been piled up, and where. I assumed The Independent or the Orwell Prize people were doing this, but clearly if they were they aren't going to publish their findings.<br /><br />The odd thing is that he could have written better articles if he wasn't propagandising. It would be much more interesting to read a true account of him in Iraq, clumsily trying to find out what people think, honestly recording their reactions, than to read the thing he actually did come out with.<br /><br />If you read his articles about depression, he mentions his lifelong habit of retreating into fantasies, and the fact that his anti-depressants have made him more combative and prone to risk-taking. That might explain some of what's happened - perhaps he should have gone into that in his apology, as well as actually explaining what he's done that he's sorry for.<br /><br />I doubt that many people other than the Guido Fawkes commenters want to see him have a breakdown as Popbitch hint he might. People seem indignant at the scale and nastiness of the brazen lying, and the attempt to whitewash it. That's what I think anyway.<br /><br />Thanks to DAG and all the other unsung truth-seekers mixed up in this saga. I hope the truth comes out in the end: 'The truth shall make you free,' as zafio, being a Catholic, might say. Sorry for the long rambling comment.Lurker 25(James)noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-19123080588165725412011-09-23T07:48:27.578+01:002011-09-23T07:48:27.578+01:00On the subject of more revelations, it's proba...On the subject of more revelations, it's probably worth noting that guests at this week's Private Eye lunch included Cristina Odone, Nick Cohen and, delightfully mischievously, Andreas Whittam Smith.<br /><br />So it will be very very surprising indeed if next week's issue ignores the Hari story.Horsemachinenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-89029858209290051932011-09-23T07:15:39.228+01:002011-09-23T07:15:39.228+01:00On the subject of Alex Higgins, if he is real and ...On the subject of Alex Higgins, if he is real and a teacher, then he will be on the GTCE teaching register.<br /><br />If, for any reason, the contributors to this thread are in touch with Alex Higgins they should ask him which school he works in, then a inquiry can be made to the GTCE<br />http://www.gtce.org.uk/gtc/what_the_gtc_does/register_of_teachers/Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-69067287338250406702011-09-23T02:31:46.547+01:002011-09-23T02:31:46.547+01:00The more and more I read about Hari, the more and ...The more and more I read about Hari, the more and more I am convinced he has narcissistic personality disorder. Consider this from http://www.mentalhealth.com/dis/p20-pe07.html<br /><br />"Complications:<br /><br />Vulnerability in self-esteem makes individuals with this disorder very sensitive to criticism or defeat. Although they may not show it outwardly, criticism may haunt these individuals these individuals and may leave them feeling humiliated, degraded, hollow, and empty. They may react with disdain, rage, or defiant counterattack. Their social life is often impaired due to problems derived from entitlement, the need for admiration, and the relative disregard for the sensitivities of others. Though their excessive ambition and confidence may lead to high achievement; performance may be disrupted due to intolerance of criticism or defeat. Sometimes vocational functioning can be very low, reflecting an unwillingness to take a risk in competitive or other situations in which defeat is possible. Individuals with this disorder have special difficulties adjusting to growing old and losing their former ?superiority?. <br /><br />Comorbidity:<br /><br />In this disorder, sustained feelings of shame or humiliation and the attendant self-criticism may be associated with social withdrawal, depressed mood, and Dysthymic or Major Depressive Disorder. In contrast, sustained periods of grandiosity may be associated with a hypomanic mood. Anorexia Nervosa, Substance-Related Disorders (especially related to cocaine), and other Personality Disorders (especially Histrionic, Borderline, Antisocial, and Paranoid) frequently co-occur with this disorder."<br /><br /><br /><br />And also these basic diagnostic traits of Narcissism from http://narcissisticpersonalitydisorder.org/<br /><br />"An inability to listen to others, and a lack of awareness of another person’s deadlines, time frames, interests or perspectives.<br /><br />An inability to admit wrongdoing - even sometimes when presented with objective evidence of their errors or behavior.<br /><br />Coldness, or overly practical responses to interpersonal relationships; a sense of distance or matter-of-factness, emotionally.<br /><br />Can be prone to severe bouts of anger, particularly if directions or orders are not followed.<br /><br />Has the ability to write friends off forever, often over small or only ‘imaginary’ transgressions."<br /><br /><br />Can anyone offer a more educated opinion on his personality? I'm not a psychologist and I obviously have never met Hari. If Hari does indeed have NPD then none of his behaviour should come as a surprise. I agree with Vic's comment above. I fully expect more and more of this kind of behaviour.Graemenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-59616464417428330232011-09-23T01:04:28.343+01:002011-09-23T01:04:28.343+01:00Love this, from Hari on a visit to Iraq in 2002:
...Love this, from Hari on a visit to Iraq in 2002:<br /><br /><i>If I didn't know better, I would swear that Saddam Hussein had deliberately scattered the most dignified, stoical Iraqis and - especially - the cutest doe-eyed children in our paths, and trained them to say lines riddled with pathos about sanctions.</i><br /><br />It's amazing how his guilt creeps into his articles even then. Deeply ironic quote in the light of what we now know about his "interview" technique.Tom Youngnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-38884039200687949702011-09-23T00:51:16.736+01:002011-09-23T00:51:16.736+01:00If "Alex Higgins" is actually Alex Higgi...<i>If</i> "Alex Higgins" is actually Alex Higgins, and not just Hari and his multiple narcissisms, he needs to explain why, in 2007, after the Hari sock "Niko" said in comment #16 <i>[see above]</i> "I’m not Johann, as Alex H who has met me will attest", did he not, in comment #27, refute thisThridingnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-11012284775568084162011-09-23T00:26:32.816+01:002011-09-23T00:26:32.816+01:00Chris, thanks. Perhaps just as well!
Tom, I suspe...Chris, thanks. Perhaps just as well!<br /><br />Tom, I suspect it may be that nothing has come forward yet precisely because of the difficulty of proof.<br /><br />John S, no problem, and sorry for inadvertently creating red herrings! It was a bit of a confusing post, I admit, as I went off on a tangent. I think you've got the chronology a bit off there, though. The DSG DSG blog and Brian Whelan's proof of plagiarism came first here, then Guy, me, David and others took it up some more. All that was in June. Nick Cohen's piece about sockpuppetry was in July, and came as a complete surprise. <br /><br />I think the sheer extent of the plagiarism leads to the question of fabrication. If you take out the plagiarized quotes from the Malalai Joya interview, you are left with:<br /><br />1. A few sentences about meeting her and saying goodbye.<br />2. Quite a lot of background about her life told in third person out of quotes, much of it also lifted vebatim or near-verbatim from her memoir.<br />3. All the body language stuff to mask the plagiarized quotes.<br /><br />I don't think there's a single significant quote in the interview that wasn't plagiarized. The obvious question is 'Did he even meet her? And if so, for how long, and what really happened?'<br /><br />I've gone through some of his interviews, as have others, and it's the same pattern in them all. But others I haven't written up include his interviews with Gerry Adams and Larry Flynt, both of which also steal all the juicy quotes from their memoirs in this way, and pad out with all the other stuff. I was naively hoping The Independent would go through his articles and look at all this, but it seems they haven't. Clearly Hari's 'apology' is total nonsense. It looks like he did this systematically.<br /><br />Then you move on to his interviews with people who are not celebrities, and it gets much worse. It becomes very obvious where the joins are, and they are mostly, as you say, in too-good-to-be-true quotes. At the risk of my post combusting again, compare these two articles by Hari.<br /><br />http://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/2006/10/anafghanopiumdeal/<br /><br />Full version available here: http://johannhari.com/2006/09/29/an-afghan-opium-deal/<br /><br />And, from a week later:<br /><br />http://articles.latimes.com/2006/nov/06/opinion/oe-hari6<br /><br />They're essentially the same, except for the later version has front and centre an interview with an Afghan teacher. Her profession is very tenuously linked to the subject at hand - Hari argues that the drug trade fuels the Taliban and that means attacks on schools, so if drugs aren't legalized in Afghanistan this one woman will likely be attacked. It's that preposterous. His whole argument is a non-starter, because anyone who knows anything about Afghanistan will tell you that the legal trade in opiates will never be attractive because it can't garner the same profits. <br /><br />But Hari manages to have it so that this teacher, about whom we know very little indeed, makes his precise point for him. How likely is it that Hari would ask this teacher what she thinks will happen if George W Bush's drugs policy does not succeed? How likely is it she would reply like this? '"My school will be destroyed forever." She pauses. "All women love their freedom. Who wants to be a prisoner and to be illiterate? Not Afghan women.... You promised you would not let this happen to us again. You promised."'<br /><br />It's obvious fiction. And I suspect there are many more examples in Hari's articles.Jeremy Dunshttp://jeremyduns.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-56004881419215138272011-09-23T00:24:21.576+01:002011-09-23T00:24:21.576+01:00For those who can't be bothered to plough thro...For those who can't be bothered to plough through Popbitch's email: "It's good to hear that Johann Hari has decided to take a course in journalism if only because it means it'll get him out of the house a bit more. Visitors chez Hari have been subject to some rather icky sights. One friend who visited during one of his darker hours found the toilet full to the brim with shit. It was blocked, and obviously had been for a while, but that hadn't deterred him from continuing to use it." Replace the word "toilet" with "internet" etc etcThridingnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-88821153273501507112011-09-23T00:00:58.400+01:002011-09-23T00:00:58.400+01:00It's interesting that david r from meth produc...It's interesting that david r from meth productions created rob blackhurst's Wikipedia page:<br /><br />http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Rob_Blackhurst&action=history<br /><br />The page itself features a quote from Johann Hari:<br /><br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rob_Blackhurst<br /><br />Also, there's a rather unpleasant story about Johann Hari and a blocked toilet in this week's Popbitch email which, if it's true, would suggest that he's not entirely well.An interested partynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-78491576234903130192011-09-22T23:59:17.011+01:002011-09-22T23:59:17.011+01:00@Jeremy Duns
I apologise for misinterpreting your...@Jeremy Duns<br /><br />I apologise for misinterpreting your previous post. It's a long thread, and by the time I got towards the end of it the distinctions between who was saying who was real, or fabricated, or a sockpuppet had become blurred.<br /><br />I agree that Hari's ability to find the perfect quote from the perfect source within a non-Anglophone and uncheckable crowd has been uncanny. <br /><br />Private Eye have been onto this for years, but it was only *after* the David R link (from the Nick Cohen Observer article, followed up by Cristina Odone)that yourself, Guy Walters and Brian Whelan made the plagiarism an issue. And the fabrication became an issue after that. <br /><br />I actually think the Hari affair is even worse than Stephen Glass (which was bad enough) because it mirrors Glass only in the fabrication aspect. On top of that there's stealing other journalists' work (which Glass never did) and the creating of a new identity to cover your other actions (which Glass sort-of did, to "back up" his stories, but his efforts were unsophisticated and not used to seperately denigrate others). I beggars belief that the Indy have blundered into keeping him on.John Snoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-74597849085011106892011-09-22T23:57:52.797+01:002011-09-22T23:57:52.797+01:00@Johann harry
This, I think, is unfortunately pre...@Johann harry<br /><br />This, I think, is unfortunately precisely the most likely outcome: there simply won't be proof that Hari is Zafio, despite a strong suspicion. I think Jeremy Duns is right that Hari must only have admitted DavidR because of the IP address at the Indy thing; he simply couldn't sustain the fiction to people who actually work there.<br /><br />By the way, does anyone know anything more about these supposed revelations still to come? There was a reference in Cristina Odone's most recent article, also some hints on some of these Wikipedia talk pages. Very intriguing, but I wonder why people are sitting on them if they're so sensational?Tom Youngnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-12131557320885765522011-09-22T23:50:16.658+01:002011-09-22T23:50:16.658+01:00@ Johann Harry
There are a couple of things I am ...@ Johann Harry<br /><br />There are a couple of things I am waiting to check and, if there is information worth sharing, I will do.Jack of Kenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00519002603649560097noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-41365680885158159562011-09-22T23:44:13.337+01:002011-09-22T23:44:13.337+01:00Jeremy,
There's no comment from you in the Sp...Jeremy,<br /><br />There's no comment from you in the Spam folder this time I'm afraid. I don't know what happened there.<br /><br />I should mention to all involved in this most intriguing thread that I never moderate or delete comments. However, if your comment includes many web links and you're not logged in, Blogger is liable to automatically class it as spam. If that happens, and I don't spot it first, e-mail me on chrissnowdon@yahoo.co.ukChristopher Snowdonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15963753745009712865noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-19105414451239966722011-09-22T23:31:43.344+01:002011-09-22T23:31:43.344+01:00I'll take it my other comment has been swallow...I'll take it my other comment has been swallowed. For the sake of clarity:<br /><br />I don't think Hari used the name 'Rob Blackhurst' as a sockpuppet. I think it's clear RB exists in real life, and is a friend and admirer of Hari (he mentions him on his site as such). Hari did use the name of another journalist as a sockpuppet, but David Rose is also a much blander name, and I just don't think Hari would be that stupid. So I think the Rob Blackhurst who edited Hari's page was the real Rob Blackhurst. Hari, as has now been pointed out, created Blackhurst's page.<br /><br />I don't believe Alex Higgins is a sockpuppet of Hari. It's clear he's a real person.<br /><br />But this means that at least two of Hari's friends/fans have edited his Wikipedia page, and so there seems to be some sort of backscratching going on. That could just be because they all rather like each other, or it could be an arrangement where Hari has asked them to.<br /><br />But, fascinating as all this is, I think it is a bit of a distraction. The real scandal is not this or even the plagiarism. It's the fabrication. I was reading a report by Hari yesterday from Iraq, and his main interviewee is just obviously, for several reasons, invented. The same applies to many of his other reports, especially from foreign climes. A lot of the quotes are really emotional, often appealing directly to the Western liberal reader. I don't think The Independent has looked at this at all. But I think in time it will become clear that Hari has not just lied about the extent of his sockpuppeting and plagiarism, but that, like Jayson Blair and Stephen Glass, he spent years fabricating material for his articles.<br /><br />My other post is going to turn up now, isn't it?Jeremy Dunshttp://jeremyduns.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-44465518654209126502011-09-22T23:23:20.859+01:002011-09-22T23:23:20.859+01:00@An interested party
I hope "Popbitch" ...@An interested party<br /><br />I hope "Popbitch" or their source are making that up, because that's just gross. <br /><br />If it is true, doesn't he have some family or friends who can take care of him rather than report such embarrassing anecdotes?Augustinenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-22303127693052430362011-09-22T23:19:10.576+01:002011-09-22T23:19:10.576+01:00DAG - have you still got ongoing enquiries that co...DAG - have you still got ongoing enquiries that could clarify things? Or are we going to be left in a limbo, with Zafio just looking exceedingly dodgy but with no 'smoking gun'?Johann Harrynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3585028625507474093.post-36924669219210710602011-09-22T23:18:43.079+01:002011-09-22T23:18:43.079+01:00Hmmm.. I just posted somethign rather long and it ...Hmmm.. I just posted somethign rather long and it seems to have disappeared. John S, read my post mentioning Rob Blackhurst - I state he is real in it. That was my point about him. He's under suspicion of being a sockpuppet, but he's real - rather a well-known journalist.Jeremy Dunshttp://jeremyduns.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.com